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JeffTucker

Posts: 8,596
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 26 Mar 25, 01:45   in response to: RobM in response to: RobM
 
RobM wrote:
Maybe the GUI texts could be updated to explicitly state 'slide images' instead of just 'images'.

Well, let's not get carried away. If you use one of my skins, and you choose the jAlbum core setting to produce WEBP outputs, you get thumbnails, slide images, and folder images that are all WEBP.

The exception is the theme image, of course. Familiar territory. It's been a while since we ventured down that particular rabbit hole. ;)
Merlin2504

Posts: 332
Registered: 25-Jul-2016
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 26 Mar 25, 02:52   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
Was mich persönlich wundert, dass das WEBP-Format hier so schlecht gemacht wird. Mein SEO Anbieter und mein Software Hersteller setzen auf das WEBP-Format, da es bei wesentlich kleineren Dateien eine gute Bildqualität liefert.
Was da eben anders ist, das von einen ursprünglichen Format von jpg in WEBP-Format konvertiert wird.
Ich entwickle heute noch meine RAW Dateien in Lightroom. Und übergebe an jAlbum nur jpg.
Vielleicht liegt da die schlechte Qualität vom in jAlbum erzeugten WEBP-Format?
Laza

Posts: 1,580
Registered: 6-Sep-2005
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 26 Mar 25, 06:47   in response to: nigel-aves in response to: nigel-aves
 
The most visible part of the degradation happens on the smooth gradients - like the clouds -, so I can not tell these apart from the face part.

Historically, jAlbum did not have WebP support, which came long after my skins had a separate folder and hero image generation.

In the first version, the WebP file size was dramatically smaller, but the visible blockiness was so strong that we had to ask the WebP library's author to refine the default settings. After that, the benefit of WebP vanished. Perhaps there could be better WebP libraries for Java. If you can find one, please give us a link.

As far as I can see, jAlbum still does not offer WebP generation for the skins. It saves images in JPEG or PNG, depending on the input image. (See the API doc) So, even if I had time for this development, I could not achieve this functionality. But I am working on a new skin that might attract more users. As we don't have infinite time, we must prioritize,
RobM

Posts: 4,092
Registered: 4-Aug-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 26 Mar 25, 12:02   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
JeffTucker wrote:
RobM wrote:
Maybe the GUI texts could be updated to explicitly state 'slide images' instead of just 'images'.

Well, let's not get carried away. If you use one of my skins, and you choose the jAlbum core setting to produce WEBP outputs, you get thumbnails, slide images, and folder images that are all WEBP.

The exception is the theme image, of course. Familiar territory. It's been a while since we ventured down that particular rabbit hole. ;)

Although folder images tend to be bigger than ‘thumbnails’, they are still used as thumbnail images. That’s my get out anyway ;)

I’ve updated the wiki images page to state that the output format may not be honoured by all skins, especially if the skin produces folder images but the folder bounds is not available.

Theme images can be made to honour the output format. I’ll have to look how I did it with my skins in init.groovy
RobM

Posts: 4,092
Registered: 4-Aug-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 26 Mar 25, 12:09   in response to: Laza in response to: Laza
 
Laza wrote:
As far as I can see, jAlbum still does not offer WebP generation for the skins. It saves images in JPEG or PNG, depending on the input image. (See the API doc)

There is the set outputFormat() api call, https://jalbum.net/api/se/datadosen/jalbum/AlbumBean.html#setOutputFormat(net.jalbum.OutputFormat)
Laza

Posts: 1,580
Registered: 6-Sep-2005
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 26 Mar 25, 15:57   in response to: RobM in response to: RobM
 
Isn't this for setting the output format at the beginning of the Make album task? If so, then why AlbumObject.saveImage() does not respect this? What would happen if I changed the output format in the middle of Make album?
RobM

Posts: 4,092
Registered: 4-Aug-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 26 Mar 25, 16:38   in response to: Laza in response to: Laza
 
Laza wrote:
Isn't this for setting the output format at the beginning of the Make album task? If so, then why AlbumObject.saveImage() does not respect this? What would happen if I changed the output format in the middle of Make album?
You can certainly read the output format in init, don’t know about setting it, not tried it. When it comes to the api, for me, it is still often trial and error.
Laza

Posts: 1,580
Registered: 6-Sep-2005
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 27 Mar 25, 08:32   in response to: RobM in response to: RobM
 
I will ask David. Even if I know the output format is WebP, the ao.saveImage() function does not respect it, and I cannot force the function to save in a specific format.
RobM

Posts: 4,092
Registered: 4-Aug-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 27 Mar 25, 11:15   in response to: Laza in response to: Laza
 
Laza wrote:
I will ask David. Even if I know the output format is WebP, the ao.saveImage() function does not respect it, and I cannot force the function to save in a specific format.
For theme images I use method 2A: https://jalbum.net/help/en/Sample_scripts#Theme_images
That produces Webp theme images if Webp is the output format. But it does mean theme images are remade on every make album.
JeffTucker

Posts: 8,596
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 27 Mar 25, 12:20   in response to: RobM in response to: RobM
 
RobM wrote:
For theme images I use method 2A: https://jalbum.net/help/en/Sample_scripts#Theme_images
That produces Webp theme images if Webp is the output format. But it does mean theme images are remade on every make album.

And in my tests, the resulting image is clearly inferior to the JPG version - blockiness, loss of clarity, and even some color shifts. But the file is only about 20% smaller. I won't use it in my skins.
Laza

Posts: 1,580
Registered: 6-Sep-2005
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 27 Mar 25, 15:14   in response to: RobM in response to: RobM
 
Unfortunately, I cannot use the theme image creator built-in jAlbum, as my skins offer more features: 3 different sizes, B&W, HiDpi.
JeffTucker

Posts: 8,596
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 27 Mar 25, 15:34   in response to: Laza in response to: Laza
 
You can work around the grayscale issue, but the others would be tricky. It's annoying that CSS won't allow filters on background images. In my skins, after processing each folder, I pump the theme image through jAlbum's Grayscale() filter if the user has chosen B&W. Clunky, but it works. :)
RobM

Posts: 4,092
Registered: 4-Aug-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 27 Mar 25, 20:18   in response to: Laza in response to: Laza
 
Just tried an experiment using the system console:
// Code input area
AlbumObject[] selectedAos = JAlbumContext.getInstance().getExplorer().explorer.getSelectedAlbumObjects();
rif = selectedAos[0].getRepresentingImageFile();
if(rif != null) {
	AlbumImage ai = new AlbumImage(rif, engine);
	minDim = Math.min(ai.getBufferedImage().getWidth(), ai.getBufferedImage().getHeight());
	JAFilter sq = new CropFilter();
	sq.setBounds(new Dimension(minDim, minDim));
	ai = ai.applyFilter(sq);
	ai = ai.scaleToFit(new Dimension(400,400));
	ai.saveImage(new File(rootOutputDirectory, "folderthumb.webp"));
}
Selecting a single in a project the file produced is a webP file, not just named webp.

Just thought I'd mention it, as it seems to imply setting the name of a file is enough to generate that image type in multiple image methods.
Laza

Posts: 1,580
Registered: 6-Sep-2005
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 28 Mar 25, 09:51   in response to: RobM in response to: RobM
 
Thanks, good to know!
JeffTucker

Posts: 8,596
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: Thumbnails not respecting the webp setting
Posted: 28 Mar 25, 13:41   in response to: RobM in response to: RobM
 
That works, but it ignores the WebP quality setting, so use with caution!

ETA: It appears to default to 75%.
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