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John-Simpson

Posts: 85
Registered: 15-Jan-2008
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 14 Jul 21, 21:35   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
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Sod's law that I picked the worst possible place to store a folder icon overlay! (the res folder)

It now works, but I'm using that 'creaky old beast' from Gromit! It will do for now.

Thanks for all your help and prompt response.
JeffTucker

Posts: 7,667
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 14 Jul 21, 21:49   in response to: John-Simpson in response to: John-Simpson
 
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Attachment folder-dark.png (6.8 KB)
Attachment ss009052.png (74.2 KB)
There's one option that's not immediately obvious unless you read the user's manual carefully, or stumble on it by accident, and it's one that I think you might like. See the attached file and screenshots.

I've told Jupiter to use that folder icon, set to top right, size 50px, and (and here's the non-obvious part of it) -20px inset. A negative inset - in other words, let it hang out beyond the thumbnail. Doesn't obscure the image, but is immediately obvious to a visitor.
John-Simpson

Posts: 85
Registered: 15-Jan-2008
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 19 Jul 21, 22:26   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
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Attachment text-tab folder.jpg (289.7 KB)
Attachment tabs.jpg (269.7 KB)
Attachment Orange folders.jpg (298.3 KB)
Attachment offset-folders.jpg (280.9 KB)
JeffTucker wrote:
There's one option that's not immediately obvious unless you read the user's manual carefully, or stumble on it by accident, and it's one that I think you might like. See the attached file and screenshots.

I've told Jupiter to use that folder icon, set to top right, size 50px, and (and here's the non-obvious part of it) -20px inset. A negative inset - in other words, let it hang out beyond the thumbnail. Doesn't obscure the image, but is immediately obvious to a visitor.

I've played about with a few options - see screen shots from jAlbum web browser - local.

Graphics are not crisp, but is that the problem with PNG icons? I don't think it matters that the image thumbnail is recognisable and it matters more that it is obvious that it is a folder with photos in it. I might have a go at some more ideas. Not too happy with the variations I've produced so far!

What is the best size to design the icons. Bigger than 64x64 and then reduce accordingly?

JeffTucker

Posts: 7,667
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 19 Jul 21, 23:13   in response to: John-Simpson in response to: John-Simpson
 
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Hehehe.... This is a good exercise for anyone who ever says, of a skin developer, "Gee, why doesn't he just do X?" Doing "X" often turns out to be a thornier proposition than most people imagine. ;)

PNG's or JPG's, the rule is the same: never display them larger than their native size. Browser reduction generally works very well, but browser enlargement, particularly of an image that's not very big to begin with, usually makes a mess of things. This, of course, is why developers have moved to SVG icons, instead, or even to defining icons as font characters (makes color changes easy) - they scale up flawlessly.

The old Carpelinx icons from Gromit suffer from not being very crisp around the edges. At 32px you can get away with it, but when shown larger than that, their shortcomings become obvious. They probably look really horrendous on a big iMac with a double-density display.

The other problem is something I mentioned in an email to someone earlier today. A manila folder is inherently uninteresting, graphically. It's just a rectangle with a bit of corner radius at the top, and maybe a tab sticking out. Tough to make something eye-catching from that.
JeffTucker

Posts: 7,667
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 19 Jul 21, 23:15   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
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Attachment ss009099.png (48.6 KB)
And of course, if you really don't care about the folder image (and in looking at some of your IRL albums, the overlays pretty much obscure what's behind them), just don't choose a representing image, and let the skin make things obvious. Screenshot. ;)
JeffTucker

Posts: 7,667
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 19 Jul 21, 23:33   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
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BTW, try this search:

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=folder+icon

Lots of visually exciting stuff out there!

And a lot of them are copyrighted!!
jimberry

Posts: 531
Registered: 30-Aug-2004
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 20 Jul 21, 03:03   in response to: John-Simpson in response to: John-Simpson
 
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John-Simpson wrote:
What is the best size to design the icons. Bigger than 64x64 and then reduce accordingly?

Using SVGs, I have found 100x100 to be useful. It is easy to work out the scaling factor for different end results( .18 for 18x18 or .30 for 30x30).
And while in design mode you can scale them to 10 to get a better view and see your mistakes ;)
John-Simpson

Posts: 85
Registered: 15-Jan-2008
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 20 Jul 21, 22:22   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
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Attachment large-folder.jpg (286.1 KB)
Just a quick mod to one of 'your' icons to fill the majority of the thumbnail leaving a small window for the thumbnail to be seen. I think with a bit of tweaking I could make the visible window bigger and blot out the periphery of the image a bit more.

See attachment.

The original graphic was 512 x 512 px but this was cropped to a smaller size.

Thanks Jim and Jeff.
jimberry

Posts: 531
Registered: 30-Aug-2004
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 21 Jul 21, 00:49   in response to: John-Simpson in response to: John-Simpson
 
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A nice idea, but maybe a bit complicated to be accomplished within jAlbum or a skin, or do you envisage the user making the thumbnails individually with Photoshop or Gimp?
I think I would use a vector based line drawing of the folder image rather than the photo
https://stock.adobe.com/au/images/document-in-folder-icon-illustration/132033288
and I would not make the folder see-thru.

Edited by: jimberry on 21 Jul 2021, 07:00
JeffTucker

Posts: 7,667
Registered: 31-Jan-2006
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 21 Jul 21, 01:08   in response to: jimberry in response to: jimberry
 
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Attachment ss009112.png (23.0 KB)
I'm sure there's something in Chameleon that could be put to good use. ;)

ETA: I'm only half-kidding about this. This whole discussion about folder thumbnails certainly rang some bells. Nothing scalable in the Chameleon implementation, but the screenshot sure looks like what John is after!

Edited by: JeffTucker on 21 Jul 2021, 17:17
jimberry

Posts: 531
Registered: 30-Aug-2004
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 21 Jul 21, 06:29   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
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You can wrap a thumbnail in an SVG folder using an SVT template in jAlbum, (but I think there is only one skin developer who knows about SVT templates and he might not approve of the idea ;).
This forum does not show the included jpg, but if you open it with a browser it should show a picture in the front sheet contained in the folder. If you click on the folder image below and open it in a browser like firefox or Chrome and select "Open image in new tab", the pelican photo should show up. A different folder image could be used if you don't like mine.


ETA: The front of the folder could be skewed down a little more if you want to show more of the thumbnail.

Edited by: jimberry on 21 Jul 2021, 12:45

Edited by: RobM on 21 Jul 2021, 10:00
Put the image inside a link, to allow it to open in a browser on mobile devices
jimberry

Posts: 531
Registered: 30-Aug-2004
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 21 Jul 21, 08:20   in response to: jimberry in response to: jimberry
 
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Here is a PNG screenshot so you can see how the SVG is displayed in a browser without going to a new tab



Edited by: jimberry on 21 Jul 2021, 14:21
jimberry

Posts: 531
Registered: 30-Aug-2004
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 22 Jul 21, 00:28   in response to: JeffTucker in response to: JeffTucker
 
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JeffTucker wrote:
... ... the screenshot sure looks like what John is after!
Here is a suggested icon template
https://jimberry.org/jalbum_files/folder_with_local_thumbnail.svg
Once again, the forum software doesn't show the incuded PNGs

Here are some PNG shots of some suggested icons. (download the above link to see the SVG code for the fourth icon)


These are only rough preliminaries - if they are considered worth pursuing I am sure they could be improved, and I welcome suggestions from others.
I am working on putting a 1 pixel black border on each thumbnail.
The SVT file would require the skin (or jAlbum if it becomes a cross-skin option) to supply variables for the three thumbnail paths. I think there is only one skin developer that knows about SVT templates, but I am sure David (the inventor of HTT index and slide templates) would understand SVT.
If my folder design is considered NAFF, I can supply a 100x120 grid SVG on which you can draw a rough sketch outline of a better alternative. Photograph or scan the sketch and I can translate that into SVG code.

Edited by: jimberry on 24 Jul 2021, 08:47 (added additional icon versions)

John-Simpson

Posts: 85
Registered: 15-Jan-2008
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 22 Jul 21, 22:02   in response to: jimberry in response to: jimberry
 
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Hi Jim and Jeff

The SVG idea seems ideal, but as far as I know, the Jupiter skin doesn't support SVG. Ideally, this should be part of jAlbum rather than an individual skin.
jimberry

Posts: 531
Registered: 30-Aug-2004
Re: CHANGING FROM jGROMIT SKIN to A N Other?
Posted: 23 Jul 21, 01:27   in response to: John-Simpson in response to: John-Simpson
 
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SVG files can be used by all skins, but my suggestion involves creating new SVGs using an SVT template and inserting thumbnails from the project. This would need to be a new procedure implemented by a skin or by jAlbum.

The developers may not see this as being worth the effort.
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